What is Enough? Balancing Ambition and Contentment
How can you balance ambition and contentment as a leader? In this episode, Traci and Rob dig into the idea of what is enough when it comes to growing your business. They help you identify your motivations and define what has significance to you, allowing you to clearly think about the goals you wish to achieve.
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Rob:
What is enough? Where is the line between ambition and contentment as we pursue things?
This is something that I've thought about a lot and continue to think about a lot, because I'm the type of person who sets goals, ruthlessly pursues them, and then usually, even before I reach the goal that I want, am already thinking about the next set, the next place I want to be. And so, I'm constantly stepping back and saying, "Am I happy? Am I content? Am I being too ambitious? Where is this line between this?"
The other thing that's got me thinking about is a good friend of mine, Wil Reynolds, wrote a bunch of articles and he founded his company, Seer, grew it to $35 million in revenue, and he's trying to figure out what enough means for him.
So, there's a few different places that I'm looking at this from, and I'm just struck with this idea of what is enough or is it okay to be content yet.
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Rob:
Hey, Traci, how's it going?
Traci:
Good, Rob.
This is a big question today. I have to say, you're not alone. And owners and leaders that I coach, especially in this phase of life that you're in and I think a lot of these owners you're talking about are in this not almost halfway point, some people at the halfway point grown their business to a place where they're very proud of their success, know what they're capable of, have a little more confidence, climb the hilltop are asking this question.
I think what's interesting in the way that you ask it is you pose them as two options as almost binary, like ambitious or content. And where I try to coach people too is contentment is being satisfied in your status, your situation, who you are. It's a state of being, it's a state of mind. It's a cheerful heart, it's a mental state of satisfaction. It can be elusive at certain phases of our life.
And I think that's what you're hitting on, is this when is enough, enough, when you're growing a business, when you're very goal-oriented. And it's specifically for entrepreneurs, I see this because you're a visionary and you're growing things and you have a higher tolerance for risks.
So, you're on that ledge again, ready to jump off. When do you, and when do you not? When are you being reckless? When are you just being greedy? When are you just being, not content with enough? Or when is there actually a new adventure on the horizon that you should go after?
Rob:
That's an interesting way to put it. Yeah. I've never really thought about those two things as binary, as I can be one or the other, content or ambitious. I guess, the way that I have come to appreciate it, though, is, how do I stay both content and ambitious at the same time? How do I stay in both of those places where I can look back at the road I've been down and say, "Oh, I've accomplished something, that's cool?" At the same time, look forward and say, "The journey in front of me is still there and I'm still excited about it and I still want to go down it, and staying in that happy place where I can have both.
Traci:
Well, what I tend to pose to people is to remember this, and this is really important to remember, is we all want to learn and remind ourselves to be content with what we have, but not necessarily content with who we are. So, we always want to be growing who we are. We always want to be challenged, that's where the ambition comes in. Challenged to grow personally, challenge to stretch ourselves. We want to be engaged. And in that, we can have that right discontent. We can have that itch to be more, but we want to be careful of is to be content with what we have and that's hard in today's society. It's definitely hard in American society because that means that we need to put ourselves in that state of mind, which takes effort.
We don't automatically wake up content. Content is not just something, it's something we have to work towards. And you have to have gratitude to be content, be grateful and thankful for what you have. You have to have humility to be content. You have to be content with who you are in order to lift other people up. You have to be lacking of envy because the grass is always greener is what really gets us tripped up with contentment and we have to have a lack of greed. Greed, whether it's on the surface or below the surface, conscious or subconscious, that desire for more, for wanting more than what we need or what we can afford is also dangerous to having a content mindset.
So, those are the four questions we have to ask ourselves. If we are thankful and we have a high amount of gratitude for what we have, we're humble, we're not really envying those around us or comparing if we don't feel greedy for wanting more, than maybe we are restless to just grow ourselves, ambitious for the next thing that's going to stretch us. That's very different than saying, "It's not enough. We have to be bigger. I have to make my company bigger. I need more money. I am not going to sell for that amount of money, I need more." Those mindsets, what's the script in your head is what we need to get out so we can actually ascertain if what you're feeling is this lack of contentment or this desire for growth.
Rob:
Yeah. And I think that one of the things that I heard you say was the grass is greener. And I've had a bunch of different opportunities to do different things in my life and my career and rarely is the grass greener. We've come, I say a lot to the teams that I work with, that the grass is greener where you water it and where you put your investment. And I really do believe that, as humans, if we stop and put the investment and time and to where we're at, that we can actually cultivate contentment and build something much better on our side of the fence we're already on.
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Rob:
But I think the thing that really strikes me about the things, what does more mean, is you have to ask yourself, why, why do you want this? What are your motivations? Is it just because you want one of those things you talk about? Is it greed? Is it because you just need more to feed ego? Usually, it comes back to ego at that point.
Or there's other reasons why growth or more might be a good reason. I know that for us at Sparkbox, this was several years ago now, I think we had 25 employees at the time. And I remember being somewhere and saying, "Hey, I think we have finally gotten to the size that we can do all the things we wanted to." And I'll never forget, Wil Reynolds sitting around the other side of the room—second time I've dropped his name in today—but he was sitting across the room and he said, he's like, "Do you believe you're helping your employees achieve and do better in their lives and take care of them?" And I said, "Oh, yeah." He's like, "How many people are you robbing of the opportunity to experience that, if you stop right now?"
And it was like this moment for me, where I was like, "Oh, so are you saying that, a word, have remapped all of that to think about…what impact can we have with more?" And I think that is a really interesting place because I fundamentally don't believe that the universe, God, whatever you believe in, there's not a particular place for most of us we're supposed to be. It's about our attitude and the way we approach the journey.
And one of the reasons I fundamentally believe this is because I think at any point in time, if you were to ask me, where are you supposed to be in five years, 10 years, two years, I would have been so wrong about what that was and what I wanted. And I don't think the fact that I didn't get there or it looked different is a failure, but it's just the realities of the journey, realities of being where I was supposed to be at the time and following the clues in front of me to get to where I needed to be next.
Traci:
Right. And I think that why that is such a good mindset and way of thinking about things is that too often destinations in our mind equal perfection. There's some perfect destination we're trying to get to, whether it's personally trying to be perfect, whether it's this picture of what we think, if we could just get there, then we'll be happy, then it'll be great. So, destinations can be dangerous in that sense because we're gunning for something and we think it's going to give us that ultimate thing we're looking for and then we get there and we're disappointed, or we get there and find out it's not enough. And so, then we put a new destination down the journey.
So, I like the idea of concentrating on the journey because to me that takes us away from perfection and sits us in progress. That's the goal. Our goal is just make progress every day, not to edge closer to perfection, which we know is never attainable. So, when we focus on the destination and we focus on growth and we focus on progress, that's a much better mindset.
And as a company and as an owner, growth should be intentional and thought out. If we do that as a company and as a leadership team, then we are providing a better place for employees. Then we are growing in the right way. We're not growing just for growth's sake, we're not growing just because we want more money. We're not growing because we want to be more powerful or appear more powerful or appear more, so people will think that we are more than we are. We're growing because we intentionally want to be a better company. We want to provide more services for our clients. We want to provide a better atmosphere and environment for our employees. So, we're growing intentionally because the alternative is stagnation, which makes us not able to be competitive, which for most companies equals death.
So, I'm not saying you have to be bigger and your revenue has to be in the tens of millions of dollars or hundreds of millions of dollars. That's great and fine if you grew there intentionally because it's all about profitability. Your revenue can be huge and your profit can still be small. Your revenue could be small and your profit could be big, it's all relative. But when you are intentionally growing and you are trying to, like you said, provide a environment and a working environment for or bring on more employees to enjoy that, that's intention, that's purpose, that's mission. And when we tie our growth to our mission, then we know we're on the right track.
Rob:
Yeah.
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Rob:
Good things happen then. One of the things, it shouldn't be a surprise to anyone listening to this, if you've listened to a whole bunch of these, that I'm a grinder. I like my ruts. I like my process. And one of the things that I've tried to focus on when it comes to all of this stuff is having goals and setting goals, but falling in love with the process, the day to day of what it takes to achieve those, and letting the goals become side effects of the process and operation that we put together.
Just to take this from a business context to a non-business context. One of my hobbies is weightlifting. I love working out and lifting weights. And, yeah, I've got goals of what I want to hit, but the more I love the process and focus on that day-to-day activity, the less it becomes like work. And the more it becomes something that I'm focused on that I can actually intentionally—that's a great word that you've used a couple times—tweak and change along the way to set up those repeatable habits and patterns to get to where I want to be.
Traci:
Yeah. I mean, at some point we all have to decide, or we should decide—that some people won't—but we talk about intentional living, we must decide what gives our life meaning and purpose. And especially so, if you are an owner of a company. And as you know, I do these life plans with lots of leaders and usually what brings them to me is this question, “I'm at a crossroads and I'm not sure what's next.” And I help them figure out, am I just burnt out and I need a rest, a sabbatical, whatever, and just hit reset, and maybe redefine my current role and refocus, or am I truly discontent and I just need to, like we said, get back to that centered place where they're grateful and humble and whatever they need to work on personally, to get them to a place where they can actually be content in life. Or is there a new adventure on the horizon? Do I need to figure this out?
And one of the things that we establish first is what fulfills you, what really gives you purpose and meaning? And does that still jive with the mission of your company? For some owners it's like, "Yes, okay. Yes, I just needed to refocus myself and I think I can take my company to the next level and still be true to the mission of the company and still be true to what I want and where I can find my purpose." But for some owners it's like, "No, I think my company needs to go on without me, or I need to sell, or I need to hand it off to my co-owner because I'm starting to feel like my life purpose doesn't jive anymore with the mission of the company. And I don't fit in there anymore. So, maybe I need to do something else, start another company, create a new product. Do something completely, totally different because I've reached a place of finances or whatever, where I can pursue something completely different” and be okay with that.
But why I take owners or leaders first to defining that life meaning or that purpose for themselves, because that helps them make the decision for them what's best for them and for their journey. And what I say is where I want you to get to is from this place if you to just climb the corporate ladder and now you've reached success. I want you to go from success to significance. How can my life, now that I've reached this place of success, now I want the rest of my life to have significance, and how do I do that?
It can be still in your company, we just need to make sure that you're living it out there. So, that could be role definition and that could be how you're showing up at work, or it could be somewhere else, but where are you going to have that positive impact? How are you going to have that positive impact? Are you committed to having that positive impact? And that's what pulls us out of this rat race, this comparison that party this greed drivers and it puts us in a different mindset.
Rob:
Wow.
Traci:
How are we going to impact the world around us?
Rob:
I really like that, that significance part of that. I mean, the thing that I see that gets in the way of this is ego.
Traci:
Absolutely.
Rob:
But ego usually showing its face in an identity crisis, that I don't know that it's recognized as ego immediately because there's people. And I think I've been guilty of this too, is thinking that my work, my company is who I am. It's a part of who I am and it's the most important part of who I am. And without it, I'm less than. And I think that, that's something we all have to fight over. But I think, with any entrepreneurs and people who successfully run businesses have to fight that even harder because of like that gets baked in. And that's a warning sign for me of you're in danger of turning this into about you and making it more about you than it ever should have been.
Traci:
Right. And that's why the mission of your company should not have the word Rob in it, right?
Rob:
Definitely.
Traci:
It should be Sparkbox, And that's how we keep it separated from ourselves. And that helps us make good, healthy decisions for our company. But you're right, we can get so tripped up in ego and legacy and all of these things that we completely have interwoven into our business and into our roles, as opposed to our purpose. I mean, we can do that even as parents. Some people will say, "Oh, my destiny in life was to be a mom." And it's like, "Okay, well, that's scary because your kids are going to move out one day.” And then what happens? Does your entire identity crumble because that's where you put all the eggs in that basket. And it's the same thing with companies. I've seen owners just crumble when their company either fails or they get pushed out by a partner or something happens that alters their role. And next thing you know, they can't get off the floor because they put everything in that.
Rob:
I've seen it happen even in successful cases where they sell or they are able to move on because they're not needed. And it's not just the failure or the pushing out, they've lost themselves in success because they define success as being needed.
Traci:
And I'll never be anything better than that.
Rob:
Right. And I think that-
Traci:
Super dangerous.
Rob:
...that work of knowing where we get that enough feeling from, that contentment from, can protect against those, or even intentionally change the dynamic if we're in an unhealthy place.
Traci:
Right. And when we can define that meaning for ourselves, when we can define that mission statement for ourselves personally, then we realize, "Oh, it doesn't matter what our roles are or our titles or what domain of our life we're showing up in, whether it's being a parent or whether it's community volunteering or whether it's showing up at work or whether it's being taking care of our aging parents.” If we can live out that purpose in each of our interactions in life, each of the roles that we have, then we're going to feel content. Then we're going to feel fulfilled.
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The Overly Human Podcast is brought to you by Navigate the Journey. Navigate the Journey comes alongside entrepreneurial companies, allowing them to get what they want from their business, their team, and their leaders. Learn more at navigatethejourney.com.
Traci:
Because one of the exercises I do with people in life plan, it's funny, I'll go through a number of different exercises to get us to this head space. And then I'll say, "Okay, I'm going to write down on the board. When you die, let's pretend you're at your funeral and you're sitting in the back, watching your funeral and one person after another gets up and says something about you. What will make you happy if you hear over and over and over again, this one thing being said about you?" And it's a powerful moment to sit there and craft one statement that you'd be so happy if you just heard that said over and over and over about you. And can I tell you, I've had grown men cry doing this.
Rob:
Okay. I have to ask. I've not been through this process, but you've been through it numerous times. What is your one statement? What do you want to hear, Traci?
Traci:
I want to hear that, “Traci helped me discover how to live a life of significance, how to have a positive impact, and she was there for me. She supported me. She lifted me up.” And I would love to hear my daughters say that. I would love to hear my husband say that, my sisters say that, my coworkers say that, people who worked for me, the people I worked for. If they felt like I lifted them up and I got them to a place where they really felt a sense of significance, I would be so happy that I pointed to them to something greater, something better.
Rob:
That's pretty cool. I'm writing that down so I can repeat it, and hopefully a long time from now.
Traci:
Am I dying before you, Rob? That's okay, that's okay.
Rob:
We won't go through the birthdays we celebrated last year, okay.
Traci:
That's true. That is true. That is so true. Help.
Rob:
Oh, help.
Traci:
Yeah, how about you? What comes to your mind?
Rob:
Oh, I don't know. The things that come to my mind are I would love if people stood up and said, "Rob was kind. He was a good dad and he loved people with all his heart." If that was the overwhelming message, I would be pretty content with that. I saw a post the other day on social media that was, "Let's start telling our friends we love them. Let's make it weird again." And I sent that to a whole bunch of people and I was embracing that, I want it to be okay to love each other.
Traci:
Mm-hmm (affirmative). So, you would say that if you heard somebody say, "Rob helped me feel loved. Rob loved well. Rob even taught me to love well."
Rob:
Yeah. That would be enough.
Traci:
And there's so much baked in there. So, when you think about meaning and purpose and you go to work today, you have the whole rest of the week ahead of you, you think, "How can I live that out? How can I as an owner, as a dad, as a husband, how can this week I help people feel loved, show love, encourage them to love others, point them toward that attitude?" That's very different than saying, "Okay, this week, how am I going to make sure the operations of Sparkbox run like a well-oiled machine?" Which is part of your role, right?
Rob:
Totally.
Traci:
That's part of something that you have to do. But when you layer on top of that, your sense of purpose, wow, it feels so much richer. It feels so much less dull. It feels so much less at toil and strife of work, which work is. No matter how purposeful and meaningful and all of that it is, we have to remember that all of this is in the context of work, which is toil, which is, but boy, you'll have a much better week if every morning you remind yourself of that purpose and you start living that out fully.
Rob:
Yeah. This went in a different direction than I thought I was going to. But it usually does.
Traci:
Wow, we got so philosophical today. I love it.
Rob:
We did.
Traci:
I love it. We need this.
Rob:
We do need this.
Traci:
The world needs this.
Rob:
I agree. Well, until next time.
Thanks, Traci.
Traci:
Yeah. Thank you.
Announcer:
The Overly Human podcast is brought to you by Navigate the Journey and Sparkbox. For more information on this podcast, or to get in touch with Traci or Rob, go to overlyhuman.com. If you like what you've heard, subscribe and tell your friends to listen. Thanks.
