Core Values—Trend or Necessity?
What are core values and how can you make them an asset for not only your culture but your bottom line? Traci and Rob discuss why core values are important and how to create them. They also discuss how to put them into action so they aren’t just empty words on a page.
Transcript
Rob:
Welcome back to the Overly Human podcast with Traci Barrett and Rob Harr. Today we're going to talk about why core values are important and what they are and how do you get there and all the other fun stuff that goes with core values.
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Welcome to the Overly Human podcast where we discuss all things human in the workplace, because it's not just business—it's personal, too.
Rob:
How are you Traci?
Traci:
I'm good. Thank you. I'm very excited about today's topic.
Rob:
Awesome. So I think that it's probably best we start with just going all the way back to the basics of what are core values?
I know that you do a lot of this work at Navigate and why don't you start by your definition and how you talk about this.
Traci:
Well, imagine they're the riverbanks of your culture. So they're what holds the culture in and we don't want to go over the riverbanks, right? There are boundaries of the way we think, act, behave, work with each other every day. They guide our actions. They challenge our behavior. And they're just great tools to maximize our culture and develop our culture, and keep every person that's on the team on the same page.
Rob:
I like that a lot. I like the word riverbanks. I think that's a pretty clever way to talk about it as a way to shape things and do that. I think that when I think about core values, the other thing that I think, I think this is somewhat in your definition, but like almost like a rubric to help everybody make similar decisions or explain why decisions are made. That's one of the things that we talk about a lot is, these are our core values, this is what we believe, this is a shared belief that we have together. And because of those shared beliefs, we've made these decisions based on them.
Traci:
And it really helps point the definition of core values to a team focus, right? So we each show up with our own individual needs and wants into the workplace or things that have been happening to us. But core values help remind us how we should be operating as a team, and it sort of takes us out of that individualistic type of thinking.
One of the things I'd like to talk about or point out to people and kind of put my psychology hat on here, Marshall Goldsmith actually, he wrote a great book that's called, What Got You Here is Not Going to Get You There. And he talks a lot about blind spots and whatnot. He talks about the four drivers of self interest, which tend to be money, power, status, popularity. And, these are the things that they're basically ego-based, right? That we wrestle with every day as human beings. We're constantly coming up against our ego, and in a society like America’s society, we're almost celebrated in our own individual success and feeding into those self interests.
So when we come into the workplace, I feel like core values really help us kind of step outside of ourselves and think about team as a whole. How should we be behaving as a team, but then I'm going to be held accountable and I need to really think about the interest of the team and desire at the success of the entire team, not just my own personal success. Not that it's wrong to want to be successful personally and professionally, but also I equally care about the success of the team and how we behave and act towards one another. And that takes intention, and it helps make it more tangible and more real when we have these words or phrases we can talk about.
Rob:
And I think that what I hear between the lines of what you're saying is it helps set a shared set of expectations for us and our behaviors. All of the things that we talk about on this podcast, and the conversations you and I have outside of this podcast, are all about this idea of being intentional and clearly communicating what we mean, what our expectations are so that people have some shot to meeting them.
Traci:
Exactly. In our conversations and why this podcast exists, is…what's the best way to bring humanity into the workplace, either back into the workplace or to optimize it within the workplace? Core values is one of those great tools to remind us of our humanity that we're not all out for each other, we're not all just out for profit. We're not all just out for success or popularity or a status or fame. Some of those things can be nice, but if we really care about bringing in the human back in the workplace, core values are a great tool to remind us to really be human to each other.
Rob:
Yeah, that's a big, that's a big time commitment.
Okay, so let's say that, okay, so they've, we've talked about what they are, kind of why they exist, but let's say that I know that when we went through this, like we didn't have a whole lot of guidance. How do you lead people through the process of discovering or letting their core values emerge from the reality that exists?
Traci:
We talked about the kind of psychological, cultural part of it. When we think about more of the kind of logistical or kind of practicality of core values, you think about how are we different as a company? What's different about us? When we all come together, what's our DNA look like? Right? And some of this is going to naturally flow out of, especially if it's a company that has founders and the founders are still part of the company, a lot of it's going to flow out of them. And a lot of it will flow out of the leadership.
But we bring teams together, especially leadership teams, and we talk about what's the differentiator. Like if all things are equal between you, Sparkbox, and every other digital agency, what differentiates you from everyone else? And these are not aspirational. This isn't like, “what does Sparkbox want to be one day?” This is who we are today, who do we really believe that we are? How will we define who we are?
And oftentimes we'd long list that, right? We'll make a long list of nouns and verbs and adjectives and then narrow those down and make the team fight for them. I really want to hear you're like that word or that phrase. I'm not letting that go, because that is why I get out of bed in the morning. Or, that is really how I want people to act towards each other. That's what we mean to our clients. So we start to drill down in what's unique to you? What are your uniques? What's your, what are your differentiators? How is your culture defined?
Rob:
Okay, so that's a, that's some of that sounds like it's an external focus set of values that you want to exude out into the world to share with is, there's also parts of this that are internal, right?
Traci:
I'd say, most of it’s internal.
Rob:
Okay.
Traci:
I think that that's a great point and a great question that you bring up, because I do feel like there are lots of companies who develop core values as a sales tactic, as a sales tool. That's not really what core values are. I mean, you can develop core values or behaviors or beliefs that you have and how you operate towards your clients. But I believe core values should be an exercise on who you are as a team internally. Now that's going to play out to your clients, right?
So if you're, if one of your core values is to think outside the box, or to make a difference with each other, or make things better, or do the right thing, your clients are going to feel that, right? But you're not doing that just to close the deal or to win from a sales, you really want it to be true to who you are. Does that make sense?
Rob:
Yeah, no, that makes sense. I mean, it's got to be a true reflection. Otherwise, your culture, it can't shape the decisions you make and how you add people or remove people from your culture, who gets to participate.
Traci:
Because I'm sure you use your core values in your hiring process. Do they accept these core values? And you probably use them in your firing process. Somebody's rubbing up against these core values and not adhering to them, that's usually grounds that they're not fitting in your DNA anymore.
Rob:
Yeah, I think it absolutely does. Like we have, part of our hiring processes is, we evaluate people who want to work here is, are they, do they meet our entry-level values? Like, we have this whole concept of this is what it takes to be considered to be a Sparkboxer. And then, we have a list of core values that kind of shape our decisions and how we act and what we believe. Both of those things have had a major impact on evaluating people, but not only just evaluating people, but making it so crystal clear that this is our expectation during that process where people can evaluate themselves to see if they could belong in that culture.
Traci:
Right.
Rob:
And like, I think that's the most truest form of being able to communicate clearly about expectations when, especially when you're hiring is, this is the things we believe, if you think that you can be committed to this as well, we'd love to have you. If this isn't who you are, we're cool with that too, but let's figure that out on the front side.
Traci:
Yeah, definitely. And I feel like candidates more now than ever, are actually asking potential employers, “What are your core values?” Because it has become, it's kind of permeated the business world, right? The idea of core values. The candidates are getting smarter. Like, they really want to know what are your core values, because this is a big step for me and I want to see if I'm going to fit in. Clients are starting to ask, we want to see, how do you tick internally? Really get a feel for what their culture, your culture is.
Do you feel like when you were putting together your core values that a lot of it came from you and Ben? Like do you feel like it reflects sort of who you guys are as founders and then flowed into the team?
Rob:
It did. A lot of it started with things that we believed in. There was several years that we really didn't have core values or entry-level values defined. And I think that for the most part… it started with the two of us and a couple of other leaders, and we kind of took a hard look of the things we had said and the cultural norms we had created and almost factored out the values that were being exhibited there. Because we did have, at that point, a very strong culture of doing things a certain way and certain beliefs that we held that we could kind of back into the core values, for lack of a better way to put it.
But since then, they've iterated tremendously about feedback from the team and somebody saying like, “Hey, this may have been true but, or one time, but can we adjust this?” Or, “I think there's a better way to phrase this that really captures the spirit of what we're trying to go here.” Or, adding examples and things like that, that really has kind of made them come to life.
Traci:
That's so important. The whole example thing. And when we're doing core values with teams, we use the, always write up on the board where it's like, “We are blank, therefore we blank.” Right? So, if we are like, if your, one of your core values is growth, we believe in growth, so therefore we what? Like, what's the example?
Because oftentimes, people will create core values. It'll be a list of words and they'll present it to the team, but the team doesn't really know what that looked like. So, you want to define the word. So if empathy is one of your core values, or passion, what does that mean to Sparkbox or Navigate? Like, what is that definition? And then what are some examples? How do we live that out? And then when we see people living it out, we recognize it.
Rob:
Yeah.
Traci:
And we weave that into everything we do. So we already mentioned hiring and possibly firing. But we do it in our reviews, we do it in how we reward, we weave it into our town hall meetings, we talk about it at company parties, we recognize people on a Monday morning in Slack. We are constantly pointing out these core values and what it looks like in real life, and then that's tangible for people and it becomes more real for people and it sticks.
Rob:
Yeah. No, I think that's a great way to put it. I like that. I mean, and it's funny you picked on empathy and that empathy was one of our entry-level values and we've just recently kind of made a change to that one, from empathy to adding the word “trust-based empathy” to it. And, really trying to highlight this idea that being able to be in each other's shoes. But, there's this put yourself where they are, but there's also this trust-based thing that if you enter empathy and believing that with trust, you automatically assume certain things about who you're playing with, that I think is really important.
Traci:
Wow. I mean, that's so interesting. And the more you can define it like that, the more people will understand it. But yeah, I mean, trust and empathy. That's an interesting combination, and it's powerful.
Rob:
It's interesting because I'm sitting here looking at our core, our entry-level values and we have this phrase that, "We look for people who are empathetic, people who understand how their decisions will impact the rest of the team. We also recognize that empathy must start with trust and that trust takes time to build. We are willing to do the work to earn each other's trust, leading to a highly empathetic culture."
And I think that the piece that we needed to add is, how do you get to empathy? And you know, so much of human relationships and capital and humaning is all about trust and protecting trust and building trust. And even empathy seems like it falls well into that. Like, how can we really understand without that piece of it?
Traci:
Yeah, absolutely. You know what a big fan I am of Patrick Lencioni and it's like, that's his pyramid, right? The bottom of the pyramid is trust and without trust on a team, the whole thing falls apart. And if you think you're going to have a highly productive engaged team without a deep level of trust, then you're wrong. It's just not going to happen. It's going to break down somewhere. And how do we build trust? We build trust by getting to know each other, right? And we, once we get to know each other and trust each other, then we're able to have empathy.
It's really hard to be able to stop and take a breath and put yourself in other people's shoes, right?Everything's working against us in the workplace to do that. Time, project due dates, our own accountability, our own sense of meeting those deadlines being, we have so much coming at us from a technology standpoint. So, so much is working against us to be able to like take a breath, look at our colleague and put ourselves in their shoes. Oftentimes we're just like, “Why can't you just deliver what you need to deliver? Why are you upset about this?” We don't take the time to go deeper. But once we do and we are empathetic, boy, the trust level goes way up on the team, between those two team members and then the team as a whole.
Rob:
Do you have any examples of what you think a good core value is? What makes a good core value? How have you identified like the substance of it?
Traci:
The first thing I do is I tell people what doesn't make a good core value. So one is, not aspirational. When somebody will say a word that's very aspirational but doesn't really reflect them, you can kind of see people bristle. Like, is that really us? You know? So I'll watch for those cues.
I also say let's just scratch off the permission to play. So sometimes, people will put integrity or honesty up there or respect ,and sometimes I'll challenge them on that or I'll ask them to define it because those are, if you're not an honest person, you shouldn't be there in the first place. So it's something that should be assumed, that we're all honest. If we have to make that a core value, that makes me wonder what's going on in the team dynamics.
A good core value, it takes time to get to, and that's why I'll start to long list them and then I'll cross off the things that I think, that's a permission to play or, that really doesn't fit us, or it's aspirational.And then we start to get down and then I start to say, okay, well let's define these. What does this mean? And then you can kind of merge two together and then we can kind of come up with, what's the word we like the most, right?
And then sometimes, I'll challenge people on overused words or kind of trendy words. Like for a while I feel like everybody wanted innovation to be a core value. And it's like, okay, why? Let's get behind what that means and maybe there's a different way of saying it or is that how we're really behaving and acting towards each other as an innovative manner? Maybe you're trying to get at something different. So just pushing, pushing, pushing until we get to things and words or phrases that really, really resonate who we are and how we operate.And these are the things that are really, really important to us.
I know when we, at Navigate, when we think about our core values, like one of our core values is help first. And, when you're coaching or consulting, if you're not going into it that helping is the first thing you should be thinking about. It's not being right or trying to start a philosophy or implement a process, it's that you really need to see how you can help. And that's the first thing that we need to do. So, that resonated with us. So it was like, yes, yes, that we all feel passionate about that. And so, when you start to feel that passion around that core value, you know okay, now we got one, we got one up there that we really feel passionate about. So it can be such a fun, cool process if you just let yourself and your team be vulnerable and honest. To be able to say, as much that we are that as we aren't that, I think is really makes it a valuable process.
Rob:
Do you have a good rule of thumb on what the right number of core values is?
Traci:
Yes.
Rob:
I knew you did.
Traci:
I always say, Yeah. Well I don't let people go more than five, like four or five. And the reason is because, I really want you to fight for them and also I want you to be able to remember them. And if you have too many, it's just like mission statements. If mission statements are really long, guess what, nobody remembers them and nobody cares about them. So it's the same process with core values. Do not have too many core values, because then people are like, “What's that one again?” You want it to be, every single person on your team can rattle them off.
Rob:
That makes perfect sense. That's fine. It's good. I'm realizing that we're just making it under, we have exactly five, so that's probably good.
Traci:
I always say to owners, before our CEOs, our leadership teams, before we do the core value process, to make sure you really want to do it. Because if you just go through the process and you come up with the words and you write them on the wall or whatever and then you don't do anything with them, you don't operationalize them, you don't stick with them, you don't hire our fire against them, you will create a very, very strong tool for cynicism.
Rob:
Yeah.
Traci:
Because, empty core values create cynical employees. And so it's better just not to do it. Stick to it.
Rob:
Yeah. I mean that's, so much of that is just being consistent. Like that's, I don't often like to draw so many parallels between parenting and running a business, but sometimes it's hard not too.
Traci:
Exactly.
Rob:
Sometimes you got to follow through with what you say and if you don't, why bother saying it.
Traci:
Yeah. It undermines your credibility as a leader. You want people to believe you're true to your word and that you will believe in these things. So, implement these tools are great tools and powerful tools, but only implement the tools that you can be sincere about, that you believe in, and that you will be consistent with.
Rob:
Yeah.
Traci:
Stick to it. Because it's hard. It is not easy to stick to core values and people need to know that going in. It's a hard thing, a hard task, but man you will, you'll reap the benefits.
Rob:
So, a lot of the things I heard today is, core values have to be a reflection of who you are and what you're already doing and what you believe. They have to be actionable and not aspirational, which I think is really important. And they have to lay out that framework of how decisions will be made, and that how things and people will be held accountable for their decisions and how we make decisions as a group.
That's awesome. These kinds of tools that we can get large groups of people acting in unity really feels like something that it was very human and it's like the, it's the problem we're all trying to solve.
Thanks Traci. I always appreciate it.
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This podcast would not be possible without the amazing communications team at Sparkbox. If you like what you've heard, please subscribe and tell your friends to listen as well. The Overly Human podcast is brought to you by Navigate the Journey and Sparkbox. For more information on this podcast, or to get in touch with Traci or Rob, go to overlyhuman.com. Thanks for listening.
